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Re: Slow-mo thing
Village Old Timer
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Quote:

Papa-san wrote:
If you have the "taijutsu", you probably won't ever get the "adrenalin dump". I think that comes when you have the fear for your safety. If you have complete confidence in what you do then just maybe it never happens.



In my case I divide it in two; one is figting the other one is survival (or self defense). I remember that when I fought (I do not do it for the last 10 years)I did it with anger and even I had a few black belts I swong fists like a stupid.I did not have no control at all.
when I first had to defend my self against a big knife, everything was different. I was aware of the big danger so I was very calm and I think I could use a lot of Budo.

I believe that Bujinkan is not fighting at all.So you do not fight the attacker, this physicology shocks the attacker and he loses his will to go on attacking. I especially see this when training with Shraishi Sensei.But I am sure if you loose your self, the best you can do is maybe do some tai sabaki and blocks. You will loose your flow.
Too many perfect practice can give you self confidence I believe.
About slow motion, I was like under water or like in a plastic bag.

Papasan thank you for bringing and letting us think about this.

Posted on: 2007/6/8 23:47
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Re: Slow-mo thing
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shunketsu wrote:

Wow! That's cool.

Question for you: was this pre-Bujinkan or after Bujinkan training? I'd like to get to that point someday, ideally sooner rather than later.

Junjie


It was before Bujinkan training. That is an interesting point though. I learned a lot in my military training, which was mostly before I was truly involved in the Bujinkan. But most of what I learned had no rationale behind it. It was "just do this and stay alive." Once I got into the Bujinkan, the reasons why and the explanations for all started coming together. I sure whish I had that experence when I was younger.

Jeff

Posted on: 2007/6/9 0:38
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Jeff Walker
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Re: Slow-mo thing
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Based on my limited experiences in life, the release of adrenaline and the change in perception of time are not codependent. I have experienced both without the other. I have also experienced both together.

I think alot of it has to do with the attitude that you accept the attacker with.

Posted on: 2007/6/9 1:33
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Re: Slow-mo thing
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Quote:

Toruko-jin wrote:

But I am sure if you loose your self, the best you can do is maybe do some tai sabaki and blocks. You will loose your flow.
Too many perfect practice can give you self confidence I believe.


I am not sure what exactly do you mean. But I personally find that my solo practice has SO FAR caused me to end up doing exactly the same thing in the same way every time. Which is cool when you are kicking the same kyusho on your Uke's arm everytime. Impresses people (in a painful way, of course)

But when I was training with a new guy in class, very much bigger than me, and we were doing Renyo (shoden Gyokko Ryu). I found my keri gaeshi was just so so (kept me from being kicked) while his had me falling down in a bad position. My shidoshi later explained to me that I had to stretch out my gaeshi to break my uke's balance.

So my solo practice led to me having more confidence in my gaeshi than was justified. Toruko-jin, is this what you mean by your statement?

Junjie

Posted on: 2007/6/13 17:59
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Re: Slow-mo thing
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What I meant was (excuse my English) in reality if you loose your temper, you also will loose most of your Budo. When you are angry and just want to beat the other guy, you can not use Budo (this is true for me)but do lot of foolish things and use a lot of energy in seconds.In the same position if you can stay calm and confident you can finish the danger with just one move and with less effort. That is why I do not fight for the last 10 years, I only use Budo for Goshinjutsu purposes and teach to help good people.

Posted on: 2007/6/13 20:27
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Re: Slow-mo thing
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Ercan has a very important point here. If you lose your temper, it is difficult to do any of this. If you lose your emotional balance, all other balance may also go, including your ability to stay upright, your ability to roll well, and your ability to fight well. One of the things I talk a lot about is making the opponent as mad as possible while maintaining an attitude of "this is just business." That is a very important skill practiced by most spec ops folks and should be worked on in developing budo.

Jeff

Posted on: 2007/6/14 0:57
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Jeff Walker
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Hehehe...
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For what it’s worth…

I have always been a big fan of Animal’s and then Peyton’s writings… But I got the impression that after the first few books and writings about their experiences, they began trying to scientifically explain things they did when they were younger instead of what they were doing now… Hindsight is 20/20 as they say as well as with age, we learn from our mistakes and if we live through our youth has a lot more to do with luck than most give credit to…Who is to say…

In my own experience, I can’t ever remember any slowing down to the point of being conscious of it or of anything at, all for that matter… In almost 100% of my experiences, I had to ask others what I had done and try to piece together what happened by bruising and things I could track, without any recall of what I had done or how it happened…

I also have noticed that as far as I can recall, every time I have gotten into a “situation,” even those when there is only a threat and no altercation, that there is always an adrenalin dump, which often takes up to 20-30 minutes to wear off.

As recent as a month ago, I jumped into a large bar brawl to help break it up… This being with a broken right hand from a car accident, where I couldn’t even make a fist much less hit with it… Not knowing what I could do being injured, people were getting hurt and I had no choice but to lend a helping hand to the bouncers who were overwhelmed… Huge adrenalin dump, as well as a new technique of shoulder punches to the throat with absolutely no use of my injured hand… Was good enough for them to buy me 3 beers while I calmed down.

As for anger, in my experience, it can be a very powerful generator of destructive power in an altercation. The problem with anger is that you get a kind of “tunnel vision” on the one you are fighting and lose all use of Zanshin-Awareness and what his friends are doing or what you are falling into. Not getting emotional also allows you the “awareness” of when to back out or run for cover. In most of the “mistakes” I made, I was winning until a bottle from behind, cheap shots from your blind spot or falling off of a balcony had to teach me the importance of Kurai-Dori (knowing your position) and Zanshin (Awareness) were more important than just talked about in class, and was lucky they didn’t result in worse consequences.

Brings to mind something Takamatsu Sensei said about wanting Kuji to fight, and he said to the affect that just to train and the rest will develop from the training… Much like the “Shut up and Train!” in my signature.

Posted on: 2007/6/14 13:42
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Re: Slow-mo thing
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Quote:

Shinobiko wrote:
One of the things I talk a lot about is making the opponent as mad as possible while maintaining an attitude of "this is just business."

Jeff


This sounds cool. One thing I do think about, however, is whether I can handle someone sufficiently enraged by the kind of comments I am famed for.

For the time being, I'm kind of torn in two directions. One is to give an opponent as little time as possible to hurt me, which means stepping in earlier, risk a hit or two, and gain control in some way, shape or form.

The other is to let the battle go on until my opponent has given me a suitable opening to exploit. This takes a lot more discipline on my part. I find it tough to do even during class (with all the Kukishinden waza, God knows how I'll do in a real situation. But that's why we train in the first place, rght?

Thanks, everyone, for your comments. I enjoy your imput on this topic.

Junjie

Posted on: 2007/6/21 18:47
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Re: Slow-mo thing
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shunketsu wrote:
This sounds cool. One thing I do think about, however, is whether I can handle someone sufficiently enraged by the kind of comments I am famed for.
Junjie


That is somewhat of an issue -- people who are really mad can do some pretty strong things. However, often the brain shuts down and they are easier to manipulate. All in all, unballanced is unballanced, and that is how I like to keep the opponent.

Jeff

Posted on: 2007/6/23 6:12
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