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N(i/y)o(o/u) ken???
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Is there anybody who has EVER heared of "nio ken" or "nyo ken" or "niou ken" or... whatever spelling it might have?

It would be a sort of shikan ken, but only with the knuckles of the index and middle finger extendet.

Could somebody provide me the kanji to this fist, if you please?

Thank you

Posted on: 2004/12/26 5:38
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Achim "Kennin" Steigert

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Re: N(i/y)o(o/u) ken???
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It must be 仁王拳 (Niou-ken), but I don't know what it is like.

Posted on: 2004/12/26 6:12
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Re: N(i/y)o(o/u) ken???
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I may be wrong,but....

1.)Nioken

臭拳
Gem fist


I have this noted as a fist of Gyokko Ryu,primarily it is the same as a "Fudoken".If anyone knows differently please inform me.I had always chalked it up to the Ryu-ha having different names for the same techniques or methods.I have also heard it referred to "Diva-king fist"but who knows???

Posted on: 2004/12/26 11:50
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Mickey Mullins
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Hehehe...
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The Kanji Mr. George used are the Kanji Hatsumi Sensei used in his book, 'Sengoku Ninpo' Zukan.' This translates as "the Guardian Deva Kings" or "Heaven Kings" who stand guard outside Japanese Buddhist temples and were rumored to have protected Buddha.

I looked up the Kanji you posted as "Gem" but don't see any reference to Gems. Where did you get that reference Mickey?

Posted on: 2004/12/26 16:02
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Re: N(i/y)o(o/u) ken???
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The term 仁王拳 (niōken, deva king fist) is used to describe the same fist as 不動拳 (fudoken, immovable fist).

In some Ryu-Ha the term 仁王拳 (niōken, deva king fist) is the preferred one.

Posted on: 2004/12/26 17:40
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Re: N(i/y)o(o/u) ken???
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Quote:

1.)Nioken

臭拳
Gem fist


I think you were cheated by someone. '臭う'(nio-u) is a verb that means "smell", "stink" etc.

Posted on: 2004/12/26 17:44
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Re: N(i/y)o(o/u) ken???
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Hello
few times during my training with couple shidoshi and shihan I heard for strike with a name Nyo Ken. In this strike we use extended middle finger knuckles to hit. Acording to them this strike belongs to Koto Ryu and Hon Tai Takagi Yoshin Ryu.

Posted on: 2004/12/26 17:57
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Re: N(i/y)o(o/u) ken???
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I've seen it in a Kotō Ryū environment, but I can't find any references to this.
I very much trust the shidōshi (though I won't tell names, out of respect) who provided this information, but I always double check, especially when it comes to passing the knowledge to my own students. Everybody can make mistakes but I don't want to continue the line of errors.

@Boromir: That might be something. Sure it's only the middle finger and not both middle finger and index? Not that I doubt your words in ANY way. I just want to make sure I understand you correctly!

Posted on: 2004/12/26 20:44
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Achim "Kennin" Steigert

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Re: N(i/y)o(o/u) ken???
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Quote:

Kennin wrote:

@Boromir: That might be something. Sure it's only the middle finger and not both middle finger and index? Not that I doubt your words in ANY way. I just want to make sure I understand you correctly!


Not to butt in, but I find that when the middle finger by itself doesn't work, repeating the mantra "Read between the lines" usually works nicely when using the the index, middle, and ring fingers together...

Merry Christmas,

Shawn

Posted on: 2004/12/27 0:35
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Re: Hehehe...
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Quote:

JamesGarcia wrote:
The Kanji Mr. George used are the Kanji Hatsumi Sensei used in his book, 'Sengoku Ninpo' Zukan.' This translates as "the Guardian Deva Kings" or "Heaven Kings" who stand guard outside Japanese Buddhist temples and were rumored to have protected Buddha.

I looked up the Kanji you posted as "Gem" but don't see any reference to Gems. Where did you get that reference Mickey?


Mr Garcia,
I truly do not remember where this came from,I did however reference the kanji dictionary,and as Ohashi san stated it does mean stink,etc.,however at the end of the meaning it says',glow;be bright(and I post the following from Breens')

臭 3D2D [2913:8f4c] U81ed B132 G8 S9 XJ15664 【】F1760 N3842 V4901 H2633 DK1682 L122 K1409 DO1308 MN30103P MP9.0418 E1356 IN1244 DJ1285 DG1588 P2-6-3 I5c4.3 Q2643.0 DR863 Ychou4 Yxiu4 Wchwi シュウ くさ.い -くさ.い にお.う にお.い stinking; ill-smelling; suspicious looking; odor; savor; fragrance; be fragrant; stink; glow; be bright SOD

Maybe this part I am confused on?However your experience helps me with the correct kanji !

Posted on: 2004/12/27 2:01
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