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Re: Iaido and crosstraining
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I don't mean to cause a misunderstanding here. From who and how I study, henka is encouraged. When I say that, though, it's always there in my mind that in order to have variation, you have to have something to variate from. So, in order to be able to play a bit differently than how it was written, you have to fully understand the the technique how it was written.

So, don't get the idea that I'm like "Well, that's good, but this thing that I randomly made up is even better." I know the history of how Taijutsu got to where it is today. A history lesson is unnecessary. However, knowing my history alone and doing Kihon Happo exactly by the books every time isn't going to have me nearly as prepared for the fights I hear about and see on campus quite frequently (provided my usually-excellent skills in avoiding violence fails).

Variation can be fun. Variation can also be a necessity. I see it as a little bit of both in my situation. Just please understand that I do know the importance of how it was written and do practice how it was written just as much as any variation I create for the sake of being mentally prepared for the unstability of real combat.

"Some guys say 'Well, if I can kick way up in the head then I'll have no problem kicking a guy in the leg,' and that's not true. You have to train over and over again to kick that guy in the leg." -- Stephen K. Hayes (semi-quote)

Posted on: 2005/10/30 21:12
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Re: Iaido and crosstraining
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Joshua,

actually, if you practise the Kihon Happo correctly....wait. let me put a little more emphasis on that word: CORRECTLY. if you practise the Kihon Happo CORRECTLY, then you'll be more than prepared for any "campus fight" you find yourself entangled in.

the problem, of course, is having a good teacher instruct you in the CORRECT way of practising in the first place. many students out there merely think they're getting the correct way of training, when the sad fact is nothing could be further from the truth. it can be extremely difficult, to say the least, to discern that correct way and to find a teacher with enough experience and heart to be seeking out that correct way.

try not to take offense at this, as it it not intended to be offensive in any way. like you, i'm going to end this post with a quote. unlike you, i am going to end this post with a quote from a man who has been practising budo the CORRECT way for more than forty years, who's teacher before him had been practising CORRECTLY as well....

"Don't fight. Don't be in the fight." - Masaaki Hatsumi

think about it.

once again, the preceeding was merely my own personal opinion presented as food for thought and not in any way intended as argument.

mark spada

Posted on: 2005/10/31 21:23
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Re: Iaido and crosstraining
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Mark, I think your Dr. Hatsumi quotes are right on target! It is always the student's choice where and with whom they train, they get the results of that choice --- or lack of choice. The student is responsible to use prudence in their selection process as it is always "buyer beware". One of the best ways to insure that quality is to train with someone who frequently trains in Japan with Dr. Hatsumi.
Here is something that isn't mentioned enough in my opinion. The kihon happo as it is first shown is a way to learn the skills that you need to know. It is NOT the way you would do those moves in a real situation. It is very easy to stop a person's "technique" if you know what they are attempting to do! It is simple, all you need to know is that for them to do any "technique" they must keep you in a certain "space" and move their body though a certain "pattern". Move out of that space or stop that pattern and their technique will not work. It really is that simple! This is another reason why we keep going back to the Kihon, we find better, more sublte, more hidden ways to do it. This is all part of training in my opinion. One must never stop learning. LOL, in this art there is ALWAYS more.
Ed Martin aka Papa-san

Posted on: 2005/10/31 22:52
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Re: Iaido and crosstraining
Village Old Timer
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Quote:

Papa-san wrote:
The kihon happo as it is first shown is a way to learn the skills that you need to know. . . .This is another reason why we keep going back to the Kihon, we find better, more sublte, more hidden ways to do it. . .


Something I did with my dojo at the beginning of the year might be germane here. Since we were dealing with Gyokko ryu, we began by really focusing on first the Sanshin no Kata. Nothing to do with the concepts and strategies of Gyokko ryu per se, just the fundamental movement. Then we began doing all kinds of interesting things with those movements, "large" at first and then scaling down to really tiny.

Then we got into the Kihon Happo, focusing on ways that the fundamental movements of the Sanshin were found throughout those techniques. Again, we played around with lots of aspects of these, using movements both large and small. As an example of one of the latter I did "omote gyaku" on someone who grabbed my jacket, by doing nothing more than what looked like a rippling or wavelike little "shudder" of my body, which resulted in the uke going horizontal in the air and slamming to the mat. Didn't look at all like the formal Omote Gyaku of the Kihon Happo. . .then pointed out that all I had done was the "core" body movement of the jodan uke found in Sui no waza of the Sanshin, which is also the movement used in the first part of the ("larger") formal kihon version of Omote Gyaku. We also did a lot of "mixing & matching" of different "pieces" of the kihon, combining them in various ways.

So this stuff occupied the first few weeks. We concluded this introductory phase with an evening where we did "free play", where anyone could do absolutely anything they wished in responding to any attack -- technique from any ryuha or "no technique" -- and then had them see, after doing it, if there was any element of what they'd done that they could not in some way relate to things found in the Sanshin and Kihon Happo and citing where the "pieces" of what they'd done had come from.

People did all kinds of things that, to an untrained eye, looked nothing remotely like those forms. . .But they found that there was nothing they did that couldn't be related back to them.

Posted on: 2005/11/1 1:49
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Re: Iaido and crosstraining
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Quote:
But they found that there was nothing they did that couldn't be related back to them.


Nice choice of words Dale. "Related" allows for the fact that some of us maybe didn't do them quite correctly.lol. But were trying, I swear it!! Though I still stand by my spiteful kick to the back of Joe's head when he was down. It was almost as sweet as an "angry roundhouse kick".
________________________________
Juan Zazueta

Posted on: 2005/11/1 17:14
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Re: Mixing Bujinkan with Other Arts/Serious Training
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2005/12/5 21:08
From Madison, Wisconsin
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WOW! I made it through 17 pages of this crap! Do I get some kind of prize?

My heart goes out to all of you other Bujinkaners who are unemployed and have so much time to write. You should think of getting yourself a hobby....

I recommend the Bujinkan or porn. Drinking is pretty good too! (its especially good when you combine all 3 together).

It seems that the people who are really worried about if the Bujinkan is "lacking" something, or about groundfighting, or if so-and-so can beat up so-and-so are pretty new to training.

Its just one monkey talking here, but.... if you keep going just a little bit longer, I think most of your questions about taijutsu will be answered for you.

Now, I've got to get back to my research on being able to put myself in Oni-Kudaki....

Go play.

Posted on: 2005/12/6 4:25
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