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Advice to Instructors on the Bujinkan & Hichi Buku Goshinjutsu
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Dear All

I have already posted this on the Shidoshi forum, but on reflection felt that it may justify a wider circulation.

Hatsumi Sensei has asked me to regularly check the internet to ensure that Bujinkan Instructors are not claiming or implying that they teach Amatsu Tatara Hichi Buku Goshinjutsu (aka Amatsu Medicine)when they are not qualified to do so. This would also include variants on those terms that would imply (either directly or indirectly) that they are qualified to offer such training. I would ask Bujinkan Shidoshi to assist me in this task by bringing any such instances to my attention.

There are only four Menkyo Kaiden who are qualified in the Amatsu Tatara Hichi Buku Goshinjutsu they are:-
Christopher Roworth
Dennis Bartram
William Doolan
& myself - Peter King

Only Hatsumi Sense and the Menkyo Kaiden are entitled to issue certification in Amatsu Tatara Hichi Buku Goshinjutsu. There may be instructors working under the authority of Menkyo Kaiden (in the same way that a Shidoshi-ho may teach under the authority of a Shidoshi). To my understanding there are no Amatsu Tatara Hichi Buku Goshinjutsu instructors in the USA at the present time.

Hatsumi Sensei is also keen that students of Amatsu Tatara Hichi Buku Goshinjutsu are also members of the Bujinkan and this seems both reasonable and proper.

The text below is in part taken from a communication I had with a Bujinkan Instructor and I feel that it may provide some useful guidance on this particular issue:-

There may have been some confusion (from a limited number of Bujinkan instructors)in the past, so I will attempt to clarify the situation - if you are qualified in Bujinkan Dojo Budo Taijutsu, then that does not imply an authority to teach anything else (medicine, survival, religion, security) in your role as a Bujinkan instructor. Of course you are free to do whatever you want outside of the context of the Bujinkan, as long as a connection to the Bujinkan is not implied (either directly or indirectly).

Although there may be some similarities between some areas of study, there is a distinct difference between Bujinkan Dojo Budo Taijutsu and the medicinal system (Amatsu Tatara Hichi Buku Goshinjutsu) of the Bujinkan. That is why Hatsumi Sensei has kept the specific teaching and certification of these traditions as separate. As a long time student of Hatsumi Sensei, a Ku-gyo Menkyo (15th dan) in the Bujinkan Dojo Happo Hikenjutsu / Budo Taijutsu and a Menkyo Kaiden in Amatsu Tatara Hichi Buku Goshinjutsu, I feel that I am qualified to identify the distinction between these two separate areas of study.

I hope that this is of some use.

Best regards - Peter

Posted on: 2007/3/15 7:49
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Re: Advice to Instructors on the Bujinkan & Hichi Buku Goshinjutsu
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Quote:

Peter King wrote:
...Only Hatsumi Sense and the Menkyo Kaiden are entitled to issue certification in Amatsu Tatara Hichi Buku Goshinjutsu.

Best regards - Peter


Hey Peter:

Just for clarity - what "certification" can you (or the other 3) actually issue (without Soke's signature)?

Thanks in advance -

-DW

Posted on: 2007/3/15 9:22
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Re: Advice to Instructors on the Bujinkan & Hichi Buku Goshinjutsu
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We can give up to Menkyo level, but Menkyo Kaiden comes from Soke.

- Peter

Posted on: 2007/3/15 10:11
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Re: Advice to Instructors on the Bujinkan & Hichi Buku Goshinjutsu
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Hello Peter,

For reference, do you or any of the other 3 instructors have scans/copies of your ATHBG certification/credentials online for those interested to view?

Thanks,

Shawn

Posted on: 2007/3/15 16:10
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Re: Advice to Instructors on the Bujinkan & Hichi Buku Goshinjutsu
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Shawn

I believe that you have asked this question before on this forum and Alex Meehan answered it. Hatsumi Sensei told me that the certificate I have is for Menkyo Kaiden, as far I can see it is and my friend Ryo Onishi translated and confirmed this. Hatsumi Sensei has also signed and stamped a certificate of Menkyo Kaiden in English in case that is required. It would be foolish to post somthing like that on the internet, but both documents are in my possession.

I believe what Sensei tells me, but if you don't then you can ask him.

I know that there was a rumour going around that the other three guys only got Menkyo, but I have seen Chris Roworth's certificate and I don't believe that that was the case. I think that they had initialy put some peoples noses out of joint because they were a little over enthusiastic and gave the impression that they had something the other people hadn't got. I have known Andy Young for many years and consider him to be a good friend, four years ago Chris Roworth and I were chatting to him in Noda and I believe he accepted that we held Menkyo Kaiden.

I hope that I am misreading your mail, because it seems to imply that you were attacking my integrity within the Bujinkan. I suggest that if you have any enquiries like this again then you contact me by email rather than airing your curiosity on a public forum.

I am sorry that your question is deflecting away from the core issue of my post, which is that Bujinkan Instructors should not be teaching or implying that they teach massage, medicine or healing as part of their role as Bujinkan Budo Taijutsu instructors. Hatsumi Sensei is concerned that this will cause legal problems for him and effect the good name of the Bujinkan. It can also suggest that they are teaching Amatsu Tatara Hichi Buku Goshinjutsu when they are not qualified to. This is the message from Hatsumi Sensei, it is important to him and should not be deflected. Once again if you doubt the message confirm it with Sensei directly.

- Peter

Posted on: 2007/3/15 18:51
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Re: Advice to Instructors on the Bujinkan & Hichi Buku Goshinjutsu
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Peter King wrote:
I am sorry that your question is deflecting away from the core issue of my post, which is that Bujinkan Instructors should not be teaching or implying that they teach massage, medicine or healing as part of their role as Bujinkan Budo Taijutsu instructors. Hatsumi Sensei is concerned that this will cause legal problems for him and effect the good name of the Bujinkan. It can also suggest that they are teaching Amatsu Tatara Hichi Buku Goshinjutsu when they are not qualified to. This is the message from Hatsumi Sensei, it is important to him and should not be deflected. Once again if you doubt the message confirm it with Sensei directly.

- Peter


This changes things a bit:

Let me recheck this to verify you meant what you wrote:

"...Bujinkan Instructors should not be teaching or implying that they teach massage, medicine or healing as part of their role as Bujinkan Budo Taijutsu instructors."

Because it may be assumed that the teaching is from... Amatsu Tatara?

???

-DW

Posted on: 2007/3/15 19:01
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Re: Advice to Instructors on the Bujinkan & Hichi Buku Goshinjutsu
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TenChiJin guy

I am not sure what you want clariying, but I will try. I apprecaite that as Bujinkan instructors we a little anti authoritarian, but it is important to accept Hatsumi Sensei's concerns and follow his directions.

Anyway here is the same thing explained in a different way:-

The essence of my mail was to express Hatsumi Sensei's concern that unqualified (in Amatsu Tatara Hichi Buku Goshinjutsu)instructors shouldn't claim or imply that they are teaching Amatsu Tatara Hichi Buku Goshinjutsu (or any variant of that), because he feels that this could cause him legal problems in that if someone were injured, then he may have to give evidence at court and that such an incident could undermine the reputation of the Bujinkan.

By implcation this would also include instructors teaching massage, healing or medicine as part of their Budo Taijutsu lessons or in their role as Bujinkan instructors, where it might be assumed that if this was part of the Bujinkan and the responsibility for any injuries could fall back onto the Bujinkan.

I know that there are many highly skilled and respected therapist amongst the Bujinkan instructors and there can be no problem with them practicing or teaching that outside of their role as Bujinkan instructors, so that it is clear that that is not a direct teaching from the Bujinkan or the Amatsu Tatara Hich Buku Goshinjutsu, so that Hatsumi Sensei is not responsible for it.

It should be appreciated that Hatsumi Sensei's perspective may be in part shaped by Japanese perspective on healthcare regulation, but nonetheless there is a sound logic to his directions on this matter.

In addition Bujinkan Instructors claiming or implying that they teach Amatsu Tatara Hich Buku Goshinjutsu (and it has happened) can also effect the reputation of the Amatsu Tatara Hich Buku Goshinjutsu and Hatsumi Sensei as its head.

Regards - Peter

Posted on: 2007/3/15 21:31
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Re: Advice to Instructors on the Bujinkan & Hichi Buku Goshinjutsu
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Quote:

Peter King wrote:
Shawn

I believe that you have asked this question before on this forum and Alex Meehan answered it.


Sorry, I actually didn't recall that.

Quote:

I hope that I am misreading your mail, because it seems to imply that you were attacking my integrity within the Bujinkan.


Yes Peter, you are misreading my mail. Please relax.

Thanks,

Shawn

Posted on: 2007/3/15 23:31
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Re: Advice to Instructors on the Bujinkan & Hichi Buku Goshinjutsu
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Peter King wrote:
TenChiJin guy

The essence of my mail was to express Hatsumi Sensei's concern that unqualified (in Amatsu Tatara Hichi Buku Goshinjutsu)instructors shouldn't claim or imply that they are teaching Amatsu Tatara Hichi Buku Goshinjutsu (or any variant of that), because he feels that this could cause him legal problems in that if someone were injured, then he may have to give evidence at court and that such an incident could undermine the reputation of the Bujinkan.


Call me Daniel.

Agreed completely. I have second hand information of such things here in So. Cali.

Quote:

Peter King wrote:
I know that there are many highly skilled and respected therapist amongst the Bujinkan instructors and there can be no problem with them practicing or teaching that outside of their role as Bujinkan instructors, so that it is clear that that is not a direct teaching from the Bujinkan or the Amatsu Tatara Hich Buku Goshinjutsu, so that Hatsumi Sensei is not responsible for it.


Ok. Fair enough - everyone should be clear about what they are teaching and where they got the information... I am very clear that the information I pass along is from the Red Cross.

-Daniel

Posted on: 2007/3/16 3:31
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Re: Advice to Instructors on the Bujinkan & Hichi Buku Goshinjutsu
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One thing I need to understand about this Menkyo Kaiden level in relation to medicine as opposed to traditional martial arts. In traditional martial arts I can be taught and at any level can use the arts to protect myself or others, however I should not teach until given license. If I studied medicine my primary purpose would be to not just heal myself but also others. Do I have to wait until receiving Menkyo Gaiden to do so? Or is it just the teaching, and if it is just teaching, how would I avoid letting slip the secrets while applying the therapy?

Sorry if this is a stupid question. Maybe I will get a deserved stupid answer!

Posted on: 2007/3/16 5:13
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