Login
Username:

Password:

Remember me



Lost Password?

Register now!
Socialize
 

Recent Topics
Topic Replies Last Post
Wedding gift... can someone help me to translate it? 6 2018/6/30 20:50
Barga18
Aomori-Ken 0 2018/6/19 10:27
hanzo-tou
Certificates 0 2018/5/8 4:34
schistkicker
Home Project: Shadowbox 3 2018/4/25 21:44
roufus
Ichiba 0 2018/2/21 1:18
Dpinga

Browsing this Thread:   1 Anonymous Users



« 1 (2) 3 4 »


Unsubscribed
Re: Kuki swordwork
Deleted_Unsubscribed
Samuel,

I have personally found the exercize mentioned by Duncan to be of great benefit in relation to all the sword movement of the Kukishinden ryu, especially in the long term. I know that my own teacher as well as a certain Japanese shihan are particularly adamant about it.

I would mention that when beginning in seigan no kamae to make certain you extend your arms out in front of you, almost to the point of locking your elbows, as opposed to the more relaxed versions of seigan you may have seen.
Hope that helps some.


Oh, and Jeff....


What exactly was the point in responding to Samuel's question with yet another version of "ask your teacher"? Are you making the presumption that Samuel hasn't already done so? It's an overbaked expression that is as useless as it is annoying.



Mark Spada

Posted on: 2007/8/22 5:46
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Re: Kuki swordwork
Deleted_
Quote:

mark spada wrote:

Oh, and Jeff....


What exactly was the point in responding to Samuel's question with yet another version of "ask your teacher"? Are you making the presumption that Samuel hasn't already done so? It's an overbaked expression that is as useless as it is annoying.



Mark Spada


The expression is most definitely not "overbaked" by any means.

Asking for generic tips on the detailed specifics of something as exact as swordsmanship (and on top of that a particular ryu's method of said details) to an anonymous group of internet people who more than likely have zero clue about the answer is an exercise in futility in my opinion.

That was the point of my response. Any information he thinks he gleans here is basically going to be fodder for the 'useless file' anyway.

I could have mapped out exactly how this thread was going to go the moment he posted this...

Person A responds with some generic stuff.

Person B responds with the "My instructor said X" response

Person C responds with a "No, that isn't really true..."

Person D will then come in and say something as fact, all the while being completely wrong, but no-one will want to point blank tell him this because then we will have another week of people complaining that we are supposed to be working together like buyu or other sort of crap...

Then there there is a lot of noise including persons B and C having a sidebar discussion all the while leaving the original poster right where he started.

Regardless, enjoy the conversation. I was just trying to make a point... Oh, and you should have mail coming shortly Mark.

Posted on: 2007/8/22 5:58
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Unsubscribed
Re: Kuki swordwork
Deleted_Unsubscribed
Jeff,

Point(s) taken. Very well stated. But as i don't wish to hijack/divert from the original post, i'll just ask one more thing as a general question( to anyone ):

If we take your points and apply them, will it not seriously narrow the field of topics being discussed?

Either way, i thank you for your comments.


All the best,



Mark Spada

Posted on: 2007/8/22 6:19
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Re: Kuki swordwork
Deleted_
Quote:

mark spada wrote:
Jeff,

Point(s) taken. Very well stated. But as i don't wish to hijack/divert from the original post, i'll just ask one more thing as a general question( to anyone ):

If we take your points and apply them, will it not seriously narrow the field of topics being discussed?

Either way, i thank you for your comments.


All the best,



Mark Spada


Agreed... I don't want to derail anything.

But in answer to your question my answer would be yes. And that would be a good thing in my opinion.

Posted on: 2007/8/22 6:27
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Re: Kuki swordwork
Permanent Village Fixture
Joined:
2005/9/29 16:19
From Austin,TX
Group:
村民 :: Villager
Posts: 392
Offline
"
I would mention that when beginning in seigan no kamae to make certain you extend your arms out in front of you, almost to the point of locking your elbows, as opposed to the more relaxed versions of seigan you may have seen.
Hope that helps some.
"

Out of curiosity, mark, what is the purpose of the extension, and is this a mark of kukishinden ryu seigan no kamae?

Posted on: 2007/8/22 6:45
_________________
......Samuel Zavaletta

Please be careful not to have preconceptions, and to always remember the idea of truth-and-falsehood.
-- Hatsum
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Unsubscribed
Re: Kuki swordwork
Deleted_Unsubscribed
Samuel,


Although i am not 100% certain as to it's veracity in other areas, at least one of the reasons for extending your arms in seigan is to make sure you don't bend your elbows as you begin your movements. When i say "bend", i mean beyond a natural level of tension required. Bending your elbows is an extra movement that simply isn't necessary. And that extra movement will slow you down, giving your training partner/"opponent" an advantage.

Just my two cents.


Mark Spada

Posted on: 2007/8/22 6:52
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Re: Kuki swordwork
Village Old Timer
Joined:
2004/8/3 11:03
Group:
村民 :: Villager
議長 :: Mod
Posts: 565
Offline
Quote:

mark spada wrote:
I would mention that when beginning in seigan no kamae to make certain you extend your arms out in front of you, almost to the point of locking your elbows, as opposed to the more relaxed versions of seigan you may have seen.
Hope that helps some.


Oddly enough, the version of Seigan no kamae, with the hands nearer the hips, is the version I have been taught by my instructors here in Japan.

Posted on: 2007/8/22 8:28
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Re: Kuki swordwork
Kutaki Postmaster
Joined:
2006/9/1 12:02
Group:
村民 :: Villager
Posts: 215
Offline
Quote:

Coyote wrote:
But understanding the classical is what teaches you important things about the applicable.

Our movements are first practice "big" in order to be shortened later. I did not mean to ONLY apply kuki-ryu work in the largest form. I was simply assuming that if he is asking a questions such as this that he is near the beginning of starting to explore the kuki-ryu in depth.

As a result it would be practiced in a more classical form in order to gain understanding of "secrets" and then to apply that knowledge in a practical way later.

"Those who forget the past..."
"To understand where we are going.."
"yadda yadda yadda.."


I understand what you are saying but still disagree.

Firstly, I don't know where the idea of a larger form being more classical comes form.

From my experience often what is taught by various shidoshi as the "classical form" that should be adheared to is based on what they learned from their teacher ... who learned from a weekend seminar .... conducted by a guy who learned from a video and a copy of someones notes.

It always looks to me like a barrier - something used in the martial arts as a bar that beginners must pass before learning the "real thing". For example karate-ka being told to keep very low kamae and making larger punches from the hip for years will give them a better form from when they stand up in a more mobile stance with their hands up. I think that by learning how to punch how you ultimately want to deliver it from the beginning is better.

I know yours is a common opinion with many shidoshi in the Bujinkan though. To debate it would need another thread maybe.

Quote:

benkyoka wrote:
Quote:

mark spada wrote:
I would mention that when beginning in seigan no kamae to make certain you extend your arms out in front of you, almost to the point of locking your elbows, as opposed to the more relaxed versions of seigan you may have seen.
Hope that helps some.


Oddly enough, the version of Seigan no kamae, with the hands nearer the hips, is the version I have been taught by my instructors here in Japan.


I agree with you both in that the extension of the arms provides an extra point of distance control within the kamae - varying according to the length of my weapon, the opponent's weapon and the shifting distance between us.

I think it's a mistake again to say that seigan is one position.

Posted on: 2007/8/22 14:21
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Re: Kuki swordwork
Cant Stay Offline
Joined:
2003/8/1 23:57
From Hamina, Finland
Group:
村民 :: Villager
議長 :: Mod
師導士会 :: Shidoshikai
Posts: 1682
Offline
Quote:

benkyoka wrote:
Oddly enough, the version of Seigan no kamae, with the hands nearer the hips, is the version I have been taught by my instructors here in Japan.


To me that "extended arms" sounds more like Ichi no kamae... But, naturally, there are variations and such.

Posted on: 2007/8/22 18:40
_________________
Ari Julku
Shidōshi
Bujinkan Ōari Dōjō
(Bujinkan Budōka since 1985)
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Re: Kuki swordwork
Honorary Villager
Joined:
2003/5/17 0:39
From New Jersey, USA
Group:
村民 :: Villager
Posts: 33
Offline
A few points that I've found to be useful in the last few years:

Know your kamae and how to use them. Obviously the question of "what each kamae looks like" is already a debatable subject, but you should take what your instructor is showing and be comfortable in each. Practice them until you can move into and between each one without thinking. Know where your openings are and how to attack those of the opponent.

Begin each kata (or "engagement" or whatever) from a realistic distance. Too often, I see people starting their kenjutsu practice way too close together. As Duncan indicated, if your swords can touch, then it takes just a single step for one partner to exploit that opening and suddenly have an advantage. Of course, on the battlefield, you could turn and have an attacker right on top of you...so vary the distance too.

Know your "basic basics": how to properly cut and how to receive your opponent's attacks.

Practice with danger in mind. This is something I've been thinking about a lot recently. It's very easy to go through a series of techniques at the dojo, repeating them over and over and forgetting that each of your opponent's movements could kill or maim you.

Just my two cents...feel free to debate.

Posted on: 2007/8/23 1:30
_________________
Don Houle
Bujinkan Happo Dojo
Newton, NJ USA
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer



« 1 (2) 3 4 »




[Advanced Search]


Today's Sponsor