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What is the "Hidden Door"?
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Hi,

I was wondering what does the "Hidden Door" in Togakure Ryu's name refer to? Do anyone have some insight into the origin of the term "Hidden Door"?

Thanks.

Posted on: 2007/11/6 5:57
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Sean Mason

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Re: What is the "Hidden Door"?
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Togakure Ryu is named after the place Togakure (Togakushi) in Nagano. It's called "Hidden Door" because the sun goddess Amaterasu hid herself in a cave there and sealed the door shut with a giant rock.

You can read the story here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amaterasu

Posted on: 2007/11/6 8:56
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Re: What is the "Hidden Door"?
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Very cool. Thanks for the link.

Posted on: 2007/11/6 10:09
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Sean Mason

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Re: What is the "Hidden Door"?
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In this context, you can read the kanji not as "the concealed door," but as "the concealing door."

Shawn

Posted on: 2007/11/6 22:57
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Re: What is the "Hidden Door"?
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Quote:

kouryuu wrote:
In this context, you can read the kanji not as "the concealed door," but as "the concealing door."

Referring possibly to hiding oneself? Looking at the Taijutsu Katas of the school and all....



EDIT typo corrected

Posted on: 2007/11/7 0:10
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Ari Julku
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Re: What is the "Hidden Door"?
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I´ve heard that the meaning is not "hidden door" but "hiding behind the door", which refers to the godess hiding, well, behind the door, until lured out.

Johan Grönwall

Posted on: 2007/11/7 17:42
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Re: What is the "Hidden Door"?
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The cave that Amaterasu hid in is clearly described in the Nihon Shoki and Kojiki as being located in Heaven, not a mountain in Nagano.

Is there a cave in the mountain/shrine? Is there any local Nagano folklore that this is Amaterasu's cave?

It was my understanding that the 'hidden door' refers to a pass eastwards through the Nagano mountains.


James Whelan

Posted on: 2007/11/30 2:57
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Re: What is the "Hidden Door"?
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Hello,

I heard there is no relationship between Togakure and Togakushi. They simply share the same kanji. The activities and such of those involved in Togakure Ryu longtime ago was nowhere near Togakushi. The town or area decided to take advantage of the business opportunity when the ninja boom started. Like I said it is hearsay.

Posted on: 2007/11/30 11:10
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Re: What is the "Hidden Door"?
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Quote:

jwills79 wrote:
The activities and such of those involved in Togakure Ryu longtime ago was nowhere near Togakushi.


That part, at least, is correct.

After Daisuke Nishina went on the lam to Iga he changed his name to Daisuke Togakure in recognition of the area he came from.

Seems to happen with immigrants in more than one culture: I've encountered people whose family names were France, England, Spain, Scotland, Ireland, etc. My own is a place-name, in fact, from Seagoe Parish in Co. Armagh, Northern Ireland.

Posted on: 2007/11/30 11:22
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Dale Seago
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Re: What is the "Hidden Door"?
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Where last names came from and why it connected to the centralizing of government. In China this occurred very early, peasants were just assigned last names, I believe there were about 5 different ones. In Europe some of this didn't occur until the 17th century. Even today in the Arab world "ibin" is used (son of) very frequently.

Posted on: 2007/11/30 11:56
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Ed Martin aka Papa-san
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