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Re: Dan Shu
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Im not sure I follow? How do you apply a hon gyaku in this kata? The way I´ve been shown and been doing it, Uke grabs your sleeve and you capture his arm by circling your arm around his which gets you very close to a muso dori. After the kick you may change the grip into a omote gyaku before delivering the final kick to the ribs. I think this is closest to basic kata. Anyone else knows more?

Another scenario is that you kick his leg so you break it and Uke falls forward. At that point you can apply the muso dori and control/break the elbow.

Best Regards / Bujin

Posted on: 2008/8/26 16:56
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Re: Dan Shu
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Quote:

skuggvarg wrote:
Im not sure I follow? How do you apply a hon gyaku in this kata? The way I´ve been shown and been doing it, Uke grabs your sleeve and you capture his arm by circling your arm around his which gets you very close to a muso dori. After the kick you may change the grip into a omote gyaku before delivering the final kick to the ribs. I think this is closest to basic kata. Anyone else knows more?

Another scenario is that you kick his leg so you break it and Uke falls forward. At that point you can apply the muso dori and control/break the elbow.

Best Regards / Bujin


Yes this is the original form, I even checked the Gyokko Ryu video to make it sure and Muso dori is used for sure.

Maybe after the ura shuto to the neck, the left hand that rests to the attackers left arm can be used to turn into a hon gyaku. This can only be a henka ofcourse. Just an idea

Posted on: 2008/8/26 21:34
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Re: Dan Shu
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Maybe after the ura shuto to the neck, the left hand that rests to the attackers left arm can be used to turn into a hon gyaku.


Actually I was taking the hand from underneath and lifting it up while turning. However I did try to reconstruct the kata from a bad description.

@skyggvarg: Actually your description brings something back to my mind, I´ll have to play it through, then I´ll remember better. As I said before, that Hon Gyaku stuff didn´t feel right. Something in the recesses of my mind kept protesting, but my conscioussness wasn´t able to remember the form I trained.

Posted on: 2008/8/26 22:19
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Re: Dan Shu
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Algebra ...

equation of motion for "Dan Shu"

(T2+T4+T5)*(K2+K3+T4)*T3 = 0

understand ?

M.Harada

Posted on: 2008/8/27 1:13
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Re: Dan Shu
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Harada sensei,
To me your derivation looks more like an energy balance for some sort of diving aquatic bird...a penguin perhaps.

Pete

Quote:

Tamatora wrote:
Algebra ...

equation of motion for "Dan Shu"

(T2+T4+T5)*(K2+K3+T4)*T3 = 0

understand ?

M.Harada

Posted on: 2008/8/27 3:30
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Re: Dan Shu
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Pete, were did you see the derivation? I see only the resulting formula?

hmmm, anyway.... language seems familiar (i.e. algebra is quite a good language if you are not afraid to use it) , so looking at is at as an engineer:
assuming T stasnds fo hand (te) and K stands for leg (keri)
as long as you keep hand number 3 at zero, you can do whatever you want with he rest of legs and hands...



or if you cannot keep hand # 3 at zero, then you'd better make sure the legs 2,3,4 compensate to 0 or hands 2,4,5, compensate to 0...

and "best zero" you get when all three terms are at zero, but nobody will appreciate that except yourself...

that was fun... but of course T and K could stand for some other things. I was just horsing around... hahaha

mn

Quote:

petelohstroh wrote:
Harada sensei,
To me your derivation looks more like an energy balance for some sort of diving aquatic bird...a penguin perhaps.

Pete

Quote:

Tamatora wrote:
Algebra ...

equation of motion for "Dan Shu"

(T2+T4+T5)*(K2+K3+T4)*T3 = 0

understand ?

M.Harada

Posted on: 2008/8/27 4:10
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Re: Dan Shu
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My comment on how to train kata in general (rather than Dan Shu in particular)is that there seem to be many places in the curriculum where there is a progression from one kata to the next, that the order in which they are presented builds some skill set. If this is true, then Dan Shu should be studied with Koku and Renyo, and with those that follow in order to learn what is there.

Posted on: 2008/8/27 5:12
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Re: Dan Shu
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Quote:

sschmidt wrote:
My comment on how to train kata in general (rather than Dan Shu in particular)is that there seem to be many places in the curriculum where there is a progression from one kata to the next, that the order in which they are presented builds some skill set. If this is true, then Dan Shu should be studied with Koku and Renyo, and with those that follow in order to learn what is there.

I've always found the continuum of Kokuu-Ren'yo-Danshi-Danshu-Gyaku Nagare interesting. And I've thought I've spotted other continuums elsewhere, too. Some on larger scale, too.

Gambatte.

Posted on: 2008/8/27 6:02
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Re: Dan Shu
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Hon gyaku or ura gyaku are entirely possible with this kata. It depends a bit on exactly where the uke grabs your sleeve and how you move, of course. But it doesn't involve changing the kata at all.

Posted on: 2008/8/27 11:31
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Re: Dan Shu
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Not to take this entirely off topic, but I have found that hon gyaku happens sometimes easily when the ura gyaku is met with exceptional resistance. I believe I can make the same conclusion regarding the inclusion of either gyaku in Dan Shu as Aric and others are making here. For what its worth.

Posted on: 2008/8/27 13:51
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